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Post by Shaun (VAN) on Apr 7, 2014 11:59:04 GMT -5
Can we have a thread for each topic and/or suggested change? I think that would keep everything more organize especially if we do it now, rather than when we are a month into discussions. Lol, I was just coming here to post this exactly.
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Post by Shaun (VAN) on Apr 7, 2014 12:04:23 GMT -5
Any general discussion can be held here along with any other proposed changes you might like to see then, if there is interest, we might create a separate thread to discuss it.
I will post all the suggestions on the first post of this thread for easy viewing.
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Post by Adam (Tor) on Apr 7, 2014 21:25:08 GMT -5
id like to see the minor league eligibility for goalies looked at, half of skaters is probably more reasonable 65ish
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Post by Ian (Pit) on Apr 7, 2014 21:27:10 GMT -5
id like to see the minor league eligibility for goalies looked at, half of skaters is probably more reasonable 65ish Please elaborate Adam. Why that number, so others get where you are coming from?
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Post by Dave (Chi) on Apr 7, 2014 21:40:35 GMT -5
I proposed virtually the same thing. 67GP for minor league eligibility for goalies (exactly half as for skaters). And it's simple...a full season for a goalie is significantly less than for an everyday skater. A third liner can play 82 games. But ALL goalies split time. Without a lower limit on goalies, we are seeing back up goalies maintaining their minor league status for up to 10 years, which is ridiculous. Protection of minor leaguers should also have an age limit, IMO.
Adding a 2nd goalie start, which I suggested, would also maintain an advantage for those who have stockpiled more than one 1st string goalie.
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Post by Ian (Pit) on Apr 7, 2014 21:48:57 GMT -5
I proposed virtually the same thing. 67GP for minor league eligibility for goalies (exactly half as for skaters). And it's simple...a full season for a goalie is significantly less than for an everyday skater. A third liner can play 82 games. But ALL goalies split time. Without a lower limit on goalies, we are seeing back up goalies maintaining their minor league status for up to 10 years, which is ridiculous. Protection of minor leaguers should also have an age limit, IMO. Adding a 2nd goalie start, which I suggested, would also maintain an advantage for those who have stockpiled more than one 1st string goalie. Only issue I take with the above is that it glosses over the matter as a whole. Not every prospect coms along at the same rate. But I do understand what you at stating per each on average. The GP for skaters and goalies was set under a yahoo format. This was our first year on a Fantrax format. So I am not opposed to revisiting the # of GP for prospects, skaters vs. goalies. Now that we have the ability to actually make the change, perhaps now is the time we strongly consider making the prospect status match that of real life.
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Post by Adam (Tor) on Apr 7, 2014 22:41:10 GMT -5
im basically thinking the same as Dave, as some goalies can remain minor eligible for years under this format. minor eligibility for skaters works well for skaters to develop before they are full time roster players, goalies just dont need the same amount of nhl games to develop into full time roster players in fantasy hockey
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Post by Ian (Pit) on Apr 7, 2014 22:56:43 GMT -5
I proposed virtually the same thing. 67GP for minor league eligibility for goalies (exactly half as for skaters). And it's simple...a full season for a goalie is significantly less than for an everyday skater. A third liner can play 82 games. But ALL goalies split time. Without a lower limit on goalies, we are seeing back up goalies maintaining their minor league status for up to 10 years, which is ridiculous. Protection of minor leaguers should also have an age limit, IMO. Adding a 2nd goalie start, which I suggested, would also maintain an advantage for those who have stockpiled more than one 1st string goalie. Just so were clear, We are not doing a 2 goalie start. What we have is a 2 start min. Even if GMs only have 1 goalie, a min of 2 starts per scoring period is not asking much A journeyman backup is more than enough with a capable starter,
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Post by Dave (Chi) on Apr 8, 2014 11:51:50 GMT -5
I'll go with whatever is decided, but my team will likely continue to forfeit goalie stats most weeks next year. I inherited a team with no starting goalie, and I will not trade my 10 best young players and every draft pick I own for two years to pick up a mid-level starter. So as long as I'm not accused of "tanking" for forfeiting on goalie starts next year, it's fine with me.
As for the rationale for bringing down GP for minor league eligibility for goalies. Go check the CBA for waiver exemptions. For 18 to 20 year olds, the GP's waiver exemption for goalies is 80GP. And for skaters it's 160GP. [This discrepancy starts to decrease for older players.] But the FACT it that even the NHL, via the waivers process, acknowledges that you can't use the same GP criteria when you are talking about prospect goalies versus prospect skaters. That's were I got the 50% figure. I'd also suggest an age limit as well.
The main benefit of doing this is it would mean older backups would have less value, and might actually drop to the WW. And then "goalie poor" teams could use a valuable roster spot picking up these types of players in an effort to meet the 2G minimum.
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Post by Ian (Pit) on Apr 13, 2014 9:15:50 GMT -5
I'll go with whatever is decided, but my team will likely continue to forfeit goalie stats most weeks next year. I inherited a team with no starting goalie, and I will not trade my 10 best young players and every draft pick I own for two years to pick up a mid-level starter. So as long as I'm not accused of "tanking" for forfeiting on goalie starts next year, it's fine with me. As for the rationale for bringing down GP for minor league eligibility for goalies. Go check the CBA for waiver exemptions. For 18 to 20 year olds, the GP's waiver exemption for goalies is 80GP. And for skaters it's 160GP. [This discrepancy starts to decrease for older players.] But the FACT it that even the NHL, via the waivers process, acknowledges that you can't use the same GP criteria when you are talking about prospect goalies versus prospect skaters. That's were I got the 50% figure. I'd also suggest an age limit as well. The main benefit of doing this is it would mean older backups would have less value, and might actually drop to the WW. And then "goalie poor" teams could use a valuable roster spot picking up these types of players in an effort to meet the 2G minimum. We'll consider looking at some of the issues above when we get to goalie. Originally, we started out with a higher number for skaters than goalies, but some of the GMs then must have found it too difficult to remember which number was for who, so we made it the same. Thanks for providing a source for your specific numbers. And I wouldn't trade my top talent for mid-level talent, regardless of position.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 13, 2014 9:21:56 GMT -5
I'll go with whatever is decided, but my team will likely continue to forfeit goalie stats most weeks next year. I inherited a team with no starting goalie, and I will not trade my 10 best young players and every draft pick I own for two years to pick up a mid-level starter. So as long as I'm not accused of "tanking" for forfeiting on goalie starts next year, it's fine with me. As for the rationale for bringing down GP for minor league eligibility for goalies. Go check the CBA for waiver exemptions. For 18 to 20 year olds, the GP's waiver exemption for goalies is 80GP. And for skaters it's 160GP. [This discrepancy starts to decrease for older players.] But the FACT it that even the NHL, via the waivers process, acknowledges that you can't use the same GP criteria when you are talking about prospect goalies versus prospect skaters. That's were I got the 50% figure. I'd also suggest an age limit as well. The main benefit of doing this is it would mean older backups would have less value, and might actually drop to the WW. And then "goalie poor" teams could use a valuable roster spot picking up these types of players in an effort to meet the 2G minimum. We'll consider looking at some of the issues above when we get to goalie. Originally, we started out with a higher number for skaters than goalies, but some of the GMs then must have found it too difficult to remember which number was for who, so we made it the same. Thanks for providing a source for your specific numbers. And I wouldn't trade my top talent for mid-level talent, regardless of position. since Fantrax keeps track for you this no longer is an issue
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Post by Trevor (Buf) on Apr 13, 2014 10:26:52 GMT -5
To increase the parity in the league, I like CHI's idea of reducing the max number for goalies to remain prospects for the reasons that he stated. I don't know if the age limit could be implemented, but I like the max games part of his idea. As for being able to start more than one goalie each night, that's a fantastic idea, but only because I have more than one starter In general, because of the size of our league and in order to keep/increase league parity, it's likely better to keep it at one starter a night.
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Post by Trevor (Buf) on Apr 13, 2014 10:39:45 GMT -5
I've played with hits and blocks in keeper leagues and I really like them. It's a stat that you can actually play for, rather than the somewhat randomness of SHP and GWG. I wouldn't mind if we added both categories, rather than combining them into one category. Ties would still be ties regardless.
Are we able to remove SHP, or maybe combine it with PPP? Playing in a weekly league matchup, this category is purely based on luck for if a guy scores one that week...if we played a rotisserie league, then I'd like it more as it counts over the entire year. It's such a rare category.
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Post by Ian (Pit) on Apr 13, 2014 16:53:10 GMT -5
I've played with hits and blocks in keeper leagues and I really like them. It's a stat that you can actually play for, rather than the somewhat randomness of SHP and GWG. I wouldn't mind if we added both categories, rather than combining them into one category. Ties would still be ties regardless. Are we able to remove SHP, or maybe combine it with PPP? Playing in a weekly league matchup, this category is purely based on luck for if a guy scores one that week...if we played a rotisserie league, then I'd like it more as it counts over the entire year. It's such a rare category. Adding both as two cats is not something I am open to as it would totally flip the league on it's head and undo 3 years worth of drafting. That is too drastic a change. A shard cat of HITS + BLKS is not as drastic but would at least add value to some players who are virtually useless now. A lot of the cats we posses have counterparts... PPP to SHP, GOALS to ASSIST, etc. The goal is to have as much balance as possible. Ties are definitely going to happen, but an odd number of cats would go a long way in minimizing them.
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Post by esquire on Apr 14, 2014 8:59:42 GMT -5
A shared stat for Hits and BS seems like a good idea.
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